John wrote on 10/31/17 at
10:43
Hey
Dana
I can’t believe that tomorrow is the
first of November. What happened to February, May, July and September? Carol’s
office is still busy so I’m still helping out there, after my day job. In my
day job, I stand all day long, and do a lot of walking. Whew!
I’m still reading Revival by
Martyn Lloyd-Jones. I’m close to finishing Chapter 12 “How Revival Comes.”
Lloyd-Jones uses the reference of Exodus 33:4 to introduce this chapter,
4 And when the
people heard this bad news, they mourned, and no one put on his ornaments. NKJV
Lloyd-Jones believes this is one of
the great chapters of the Bible because he says it shows the people in a time
of “aridity and dryness, and then comes into a period of re-awakening and of
revival.” (pg 148) God tells Moses to take the people and go into the promised
land. He (God) would send an angel to wipe out the enemies:
33 Then the Lord said to Moses, “Leave this place, you
and the people you brought up out of Egypt, and go up to the land I promised on
oath to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, saying, ‘I will give it to your descendants.’ 2 I will send an
angel before you and drive out the Canaanites, Amorites, Hittites, Perizzites,
Hivites and Jebusites. 3 Go up to the
land flowing with milk and honey. But I will not go with you, because you are a
stiff-necked people and I might destroy you on the way.” Ex 33:1-3 NIV
The interesting thing about this
verse that I never noticed before is what else God says in it, “But I will not
go with you, because you are a stiff-necked people and I might destroy you on
the way.” Whoa!! Is He angry, or what?
“...and I might destroy you.” I’ve heard messages on how He’ll drive all –ites out and give the children of Israel
the land of milk and honey, but He is not going with them. Why? Earlier the
Israelites grumbled and complained and backslid. They became impatient and
worshipped the golden calf and called on other gods, and as Lloyd-Jones goes on
to say, “...they proceeded to open sin, and vice, and evil. They danced before
it (the golden calf), and behaved themselves in an utterly and thoroughly
disgraceful manner.” pgs149-150
Then Jones fast forwards to today
and how the Church is no different than those Israelites. “They do not believe
in miracles, therefore, they say miracles did not happen and that these
accounts are but myths....They deny the virgin birth...(and the) resurrection.”
There are gross immoralities today. He ends with how in the church today there
is: “False worship, false religion, false gods, and an appalling state of evil,
sin, and vice.”
John continues on
11/8/2017
Hello
again Dana.
I like how Lloyd-Jones defines true repentance
on page 156. He says
Repentance does
not just mean that your are pulled up , that you are aware that things are not
as they ought to be, and that there is something wrong. No, you go on to a
realisation (sic) of the seriousness of what is wrong, and its appalling
character....they (the children of Israel) hated the thing (the golden calf
they made), they abominated it, they condemned themselves root and branch. Ah,
but still more important than that, they realised the seriousness of their sin
in God’s sight.”
The realization of sin is what
Lloyd-Jones considers to be the first stage of revival, without which there
will be no revival.
A few pages farther on, Lloyd-Jones goes
even further to make sure the reader, and me, really understand repentance so
they/me don’t try to take the easy way out and copout with just remorse. Again,
talking about the Israelites, on page 159 he writes
“...they gave
absolute proof that they had repented. And against this is one of the
differences between remorse and repentance, because repentance is not just a
passing, temporary feeling, repentance is something that is so profound that it
affects a man’s will. As the Apostle again puts it in 2 Corinthians y it leads
to action. ‘You put things right,’ says Paul, ‘you did something about it.’”
Unfortunately, in all the churches
we’ve attended over the past
approximately 20 years, we have only been in two where there was an altar call “Altar call” some readers may be asking, what
is an “altar call?” Calling out sin and bringing it face to face with the
congregations has become a thing of the past. How often are conversations
started that deal with sin, let alone preaching from the pulpit?
I went grocery shopping on my way
home from work tonight. The market had a brand of potatoes that are locally
grown and we know the farmer. His potatoes are of a good grade. They are fresh
and firm, with few, if any, internal blemishes or rot. They cook up well and are tasty in no matter what
the form; although we prefer mashed. I bought two 10 pound bags, rather than
the usual 50 pounds that we buy at this time of the year. Because the weather
is cooling off and is going to get colder, I put them in the garage to keep as
a cold storage bin, if you will.
So earlier this evening, I went out
to the garage to get some black raspberry, golden Guernsey ice cream from the
freezer. We have a two car garage, a fairly large one. (I’m not deviating from
my point. I’m almost there.) As soon as I opened the door from the house to the
garage, I smelled it. A rotten smell, A rotten potato smell that I didn’t
notice in the grocery store or in the car because the spuds were in the trunk. But
to use a cliché, the rotten smell was plain-as–day as soon as I opened the
door. I picked up the bag and looked through the netting, but couldn’t see it.
But that stinking potato is in there. But I didn’t want to deal with it
tonight. Open the bag. Dump all the contents out until I find the smelly,
rotten one.
This is how I believe the Church is
generally reacting to sin in their congregations. As Lloyd-Jones says, that
once they (church members and attendees) realize it (sin) they must act to get
rid of it. That bag of potatoes looked fine on the outside, but something was
rotten inside of it and it is literally stinking up the garage, and will ruin
the entire bag of potatoes if I don’t dig it out of there. The Church looks fine on the outside—nice
clothes, good jobs, beautiful families but sin is lurking hidden from view and
stinking up the Christian’s walk with God, keeping revival from coming. And
only through going to God in real repentance, leading to “action” to get right with God and man, will the
Church get clean and will revival come.
Or will—as the warnings of Amos and
the other prophets went unheeded—today’s Church continue on its
self-destructive path until God can stand the stink no longer and brings His
judgment down on the Church? Remember in Revelation 3 what He told the angel of the church in Laodicea write?
15 ‘I know
your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot; I wish that you were cold or
hot.
16 So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold,
I will [l]spit
you out of My mouth. 17 Because you say, “I am
rich, and have become wealthy, and have need of nothing,” and you do not know
that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked, 18 I advise you to buy from Me gold refined by fire so that you
may become rich, and white garments so that you may clothe yourself, and that
the shame of your nakedness will not be revealed; and eye salve to anoint your
eyes so that you may see. 19 Those whom I love, I
reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent.... 22 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the
churches.’”
Or, we, the Church, can continue to
claim a form of Godliness but deny the power thereof, and continue to have a silence
from God in our churches?
John
++++++++++++++
Dana
Replied on Fri, Nov 10, 2017 at 9:13 AM
Hi
John,
While I see your point, the truth is that
God did go with His people, He reaffirmed things with Joshua after Moses died,
and wrought incredible victories in the promised land. Even when the Israelites
became apostate and worse, worshipped foreign gods, God still had mercy upon
them, and sent deliverers in the judges, and eventually David, and eventually
Christ.
But that said, God did not withhold
judgment when His cup got full. God
neither winks at sin, nor excuses it. The severe judgments brought down upon
His people were well deserved, but there was always left a remnant. God, even though He sent Assyria and Babylon,
and also Rome to execute judgment on Israel, still He didn’t pull a Sodom and
Gomorrah on them and wipe them out altogether.
You wrote:
“Then Jones fast forwards to today
and how the Church is no different than those Israelites. “They do not believe
in miracles, therefore, they say miracles did not happen and that these
accounts are but myths....They deny the virgin birth...(and the) resurrection.”
There are gross immoralities today. He ends with how in the church today there
is: “False worship, false religion, false gods, and an appalling state of evil,
sin, and vice.””
Allow me to track on something different
for a second and provide a different view.
I would counter the idea that the “Church
is no different than those Israelites,” might be lacking somewhat in
clarity. Now I’m in no position to argue
with the good Rev. Dr. Lloyd-Jones, and I’m not. But I would say that the church that doesn’t
believe in the fundamentals of the faith, employs false worship, and worse,
worships false gods, and openly and willingly participates in evil, sin and
vice isn’t the church at all. They are
heathens masquerading as the Christian church.
If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck….
In Hebrews 5:9a the author says, speaking
of Jesus, “And being
made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him….”
(ESV)
Did
you catch that? The author makes a clear
and unmistakable correlation between salvation and obedience to Christ.
Jesus
Himself said in Matthew 7:21-23
“Not everyone who
says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who
does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord,
Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and
do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I
declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of
lawlessness.’ (ESV)
Again obedience to the will of the Father
is tied to the one who is genuinely Christ’s.
In Luke 6:46, Jesus says further, “Why do you call me ‘Lord,
Lord,’ and not do what I tell you?” (ESV)
The true Church isn’t apostate, but there
are a lot of buildings with steeples and crosses and thousands of unregenerate
people darkening their doors every Sunday pretending they are Christians.
I knew a person once who was preparing to
graduate college, and enter an industry which is often peopled by folks of
questionable morality. In one of last
classes taken, it was taught by the professor that as soon as said graduates
should, upon assuming a new position, quickly join a local church. The rationale was that belonging to a church
gave some credibility and acceptability to an already tarnished and suspect
industry. The students were told that
they didn’t have to believe what the church taught, but that they should just
attend regularly, drop some money in the plate and be seen doing it.
Now by saying all this, I’m not giving the
Church in this country a pass. The
American Christian church is lazy and apathetic, and needs to be awakened
spiritually, but that is a far cry from heathenism mimicking piety.
That said, I do think it’s time for a
Colonel Travis at the Alamo moment, where a line is drawn in the sand, and
everyone who claims to be a Christian gets on one side or the other.
Churches
that “…do not believe in miracles,
therefore, they say miracles did not happen and that these accounts are but
myths....They deny the virgin birth...(and the) resurrection.” There are gross
immoralities today. He ends with how in the church today there is: “False
worship, false religion, false gods, and an appalling state of evil, sin, and
vice….” aren’t part of the Christian Church at all. They do not share in the inheritance of
Christ, and on THAT DAY, will be told that they were never known, and to move
on to a place more in line with their believing loyalty.
Dana
+++++++++++++++++++
John
adds a short PS 11/11/17, Veterans Day, at 4:52 PM
Hey
Dana
I just watched the Turner Classic
Movie Channel movie “Where Eagles Dare.”
It is one of my favorites, and TCM is playing military movies this
weekend because it is Veterans Day weekend. “Where Eagles Dare” has good
action, espionage, beautiful on-location winter photography, unexpected plot
twists, and, of course, the good guys win.
But just a quick comment to your
introductory sentence, “While I see your point, the truth is that God did go
with His people....” In this chapter (12) my point is taken from a long
chapter. Lloyd-Jones leads up to his
point on how revival comes by first showing how angry God was by telling His
people He wouldn’t go with them because of their pervasive sins. I couldn’t get into the entire chapter to
explain everything he was writing about. But when God told the children of
Israel that He wouldn’t go with them, that shocked them to awaken to the
reality of their despicable situation and caused them to realize that situation was keeping them from God and His presence
and caused them to repent. Remember the Prodigal Son? In Luke 15 God tell us how when things got so
bad for him
17 “When
he came to his senses, he said, ‘How many of my father’s hired servants
have food to spare, and here I am starving to death! 18 I will set out and go back
to my father and say to him: Father, I have sinned against heaven and against
you. 19 I am no longer worthy to be called your
son; make me like one of your hired servants.’ 20 So
he got up and went to his father.
This is the point of the chapter,
that unless we, the people of the Church, come to our senses and realize how our sins are keeping
us from God and His presence, not only will God , I believe continue to withhold His presence, but He will not go with us.
Your
foxhole buddy
John
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